Q) Why do I still play UO? A) PKs

[Lexington]

I'll probably get some shit for this, but I also believe that allowing people to have more than one account was probably one of this shard's biggest mistakes and can never be undone. Having so many characters trivializes so many things in my opinion. I'm sure we're all in agreement that UO is a very community driven game. I see many arguments in this thread claiming that if reds are causing you issues, you should join a guild and/or group up. I agree wholeheartedly. However, being able to have multiple murderers on your accounts trivializes nearly any non-permanent consequence they may have. It also devalues various character types and removes some community interaction that made UO so special. You can make characters for pretty much every single need you could possibly have. It devalues the core concept of finding someone else who can do/produce what you cannot when you can just log into your whatever and become completely self-efficient. It especially devalues crafters when everyone and their grandma can just log into their crafting alt real quick and fix something up for themselves. Maybe that's just me though.

No shit from this player... as much as I love having an alt character to come save me when I die, it sure did take away the excitement of rushing to get rezed and running back to your body before it decayed.

 

[Darkarna]

Also -- I agree that people should chill out with the trash talking, especially when you're using personal attacks. It's 2015.... we're all fgts for playing UO still so trying to talk shit is like arguing who is the bigger ***.

I think if we improved the PVP community in terms of shit talk it would probably make PVP a little more appealing to all involved.

Indeed, perhaps offering a cup of tea and counselling would go a long way *without being condescending of course *

 

[GluttonySDS]

I guess Im still waiting for someone to explain to me why blues are unable to work together and group up as EQMS has done...

 

[VFingerDiscount]

I guess Im still waiting for someone to explain to me why blues are unable to work together and group up as EQMS has done...

Egos. Blue guilds especially the larger ones can't seem to agree or get along. The funny part is that they won't war each other and actually turn orange they just gray pk or logon their red and snipe or gank anonymously.

 

[VFingerDiscount]

No shit from this player... as much as I love having an alt character to come save me when I die, it sure did take away the excitement of rushing to get rezed and running back to your body before it decayed.

I'm the same way. I usually just log for the night if I have used up two help stucks and a seek forgiveness unless I've got to get pets.

I still feel like alting is cheating since it was ban-able when I played.

 

[Weland]

So one last thing I want to say on the issue. I know a lot of people like to reference how UO used to be and I get that it was an awesome game, however look at the player base of the game back then vs UOF's current player base. Not total numbers but online at one time.

So that has to be a factor when you think about the server. If Reds keep going the way they are the player base will drop and this isn't a new release that's going to keep drawing people in because it's new. UOF's admins are faced with a variable that wasn't present then with that rule set.

There has to be neutral ground. Blues have to have the time to do what they want to do and Reds the same. Sadly the reds will be the ones that have to give up on this ground at some point because if they can just keep going full throttle none stop they will. If we had 1,000 players and only 40 where in a zerg guild then I would say the complaints aren't valid. Just suck it up buttercup and move on, but the player base isn't there to support this.

Please understand these are rough numbers that were given as examples.

However no Trammel.

 

[GluttonySDS]

Egos. Blue guilds especially the larger ones can't seem to agree or get along. The funny part is that they won't war each other and actually turn orange they just gray pk or logon their red and snipe or gank anonymously.

So this 20 page debate is because people cant put aside their egos like EQMS can? Does anyone else see that as being a bit ridiculous?

 

[Bromista]

It's quite the conundrum, and I'm not quite sure how I stand on the issue myself. Yet, there are a few things I understand that help get a general summary of my feelings. When it comes down to it, always-on PvP simply must stay. The introduction of Trammie invalidates the entire concept, and I'm glad that will never be a thing here on this server. Of course, the real issue comes to the age old issue of reds vs blues.

That wonderful tension of a murderer being just around the corner brought about a unique feeling that isn't replicated by many other games. Naturally, it also facilitates player interaction and PvP gameplay. A true sandbox with a living and breathing community, unlike other MMOs where you group up just out of obligation in general. A heavy enough blow to reds would, of course, destroy the game's soul.

I can see both sides of the argument. On one hand, you have the reds. As stated above, they are a core part of the game. Dying isn't that big of a deal in UO as long as you have the logic to not bring things you aren't willing to lose. They may also facilitate community interaction on the level of blues asking for assistance to takedown some reds, which is quite neat in my opinion. Blues generally bring up the argument that it's a bit tiresome being killed over and over again, especially when the consequences aren't very large once you finally take a red down.

That concept in particular is the issue's root, and I don't really have a solution for it myself. Reds can make the game very exciting and unique, but can also drag down the experience as well. Walking around in a dungeon and looking out for PKs is exhilarating and exciting. Without something like that, the game would basically be Runescape if we're going to be honest. However, I must admit that being bombed down by a bunch of reds at the same time isn't very fun. Now, the counter to that would be to find a group yourself and have at them. You can even get a cool battle going down. Community interaction is an important part of UO after all. Yet, even if you kill all the reds, they can simply teleport back in with full gear, pots, etc ready to kill some more people.

And that's probably one of my biggest personal issues. With so many reds and groups of reds, it feels like they're less murderers and more of a faction that simply kill everyone with no consequence. When one has so much power on the game experience of others, there has to be consequences or restraints of some sort. Open PvP is great in my opinion, but this feels more like anarchy PvP instead of controlled Open PvP. You are a murderer, a player with the ability to kill another and prevent them from doing what they wish to be doing with their time. Limiters are naturally required to stop it from becoming massively rampant where people are just killing others everywhere. Being red should be a unique playstyle filled with its own tension; Doing your deed and getting away with it, else facing some sort of consequence.

But what kind of consequence should that be? I'm honestly not sure. Perma stat loss seems a bit intense, but temp stat loss is quite lenient. However, let's go back to what I believe is the main issue. Taking down a murderer feels empty, for he may simply come back again in full gear quite quickly or he can just log into one of his alts. Somehow, taking down a red should reward the player by getting them out of their hair for a good amount of time.

I'll probably get some shit for this, but I also believe that allowing people to have more than one account was probably one of this shard's biggest mistakes and can never be undone. Having so many characters trivializes so many things in my opinion. I'm sure we're all in agreement that UO is a very community driven game. I see many arguments in this thread claiming that if reds are causing you issues, you should join a guild and/or group up. I agree wholeheartedly. However, being able to have multiple murderers on your accounts trivializes nearly any non-permanent consequence they may have. It also devalues various character types and removes some community interaction that made UO so special. You can make characters for pretty much every single need you could possibly have. It devalues the core concept of finding someone else who can do/produce what you cannot when you can just log into your whatever and become completely self-efficient. It especially devalues crafters when everyone and their grandma can just log into their crafting alt real quick and fix something up for themselves. Maybe that's just me though.

Well said, we need ten more like you sir.

Way better to read this post than the mindless drivel.

 

[Weland]

So this 20 page debate is because people cant put aside their egos like EQMS can? Does anyone else see that as being a bit ridiculous?

Ok so the thing is I do agree players do need to step up and challenge, but instead of assuming this time I'll ask. If you get pushed back and you lose one or two fights are you going to stop or just keep coming till you get bored or tired.

As far as resources I'm sure you're stocked for a long fight.

The only reason I say this is with out some sort of medium everyone is forced to pvp against you instead of do other things.

Personally I don't have an issue with EQMS or the current pvp setup but I don't roll with a guild yet, I'm to start soon but even then I get the sandbox theme and my life doesn't end when my character does.

I do however enjoy this server and don't want to see it collapse or nerfed all to hell either because each side is preaching what is considered extreme to the other.

 

[GluttonySDS]

Not to mention all a blue has to do is pay 100k to join EQMS, even if theyre just joining for the safety of farming on thier blue(who would show up green to us) it gives them a way to escape our wrath. Hell, they'd be able to PvM in peace and PVP should they ever be interested.

UO is a game where the player community is able to overcome/solve any issue possible(beyond fixing bugs/cheaters).

 

[Weland]

@GluttonySDS So lets say they did do something like a guild head count for instance, as long as it wasn't 1) some low number like 20 heads and 2) Crazy time your guild was not able to pvp. Would that be a game breaker for you?

You can still pvp where you want, now you have risk where you kinda don't really now from what I'm gathering.

I'll be honest I'm still new to the server and I don't know how long it takes to do a champ spawn but I think 1 hour where you guys are still able to play and scout out and plan your next target wouldn't be unreasonable.

The head count could even be on a timer so if you attack someone and 10 heads get turned in ever 30 minutes it goes down 1 head. This of course meaning they didn't get enough heads to put you on hold for the one hour.

 

[K A Z]

So this 20 page debate is because people cant put aside their egos like EQMS can? Does anyone else see that as being a bit ridiculous?

I mean they could man up, organize, get in voicecom, settle all the fights they have over pixels or... cry to Shane who obviously has an ear for them. I guess we both know what bluebians prefer.

 

[GluttonySDS]

Whats the guild head count idea again? I still think the best idea is this idea -- blues work together and put their egos aside and group up.

 

[Weland]

I'm done editing the above post, I apologize if you were trying to read it and it kept changing.

 

[Weland]

@GluttonySDS

Basically it would break down something like this:

A guild is free to open world pvp as much as they want but they have a total head count (heads turned into a headhunter) lets say 50.

So the blues organize a defense and they manage to turn in 50 EQMS heads, then EQMS as a guild couldn't engage in pvp actions for 1 hour (or whatever)

If they only get 25 heads EQMS is still good to go.

Now one thing I think would have to be flexible is whether or not the number stays fixed or not. For example they get 24 heads and you guys call it a night when you log on is the count 24 for does it slowly decrease on a timer. That really would have be decided based on how well the blues muster up against you.

 

[K A Z]

Whats the guild head count idea again? I still think the best idea is this idea -- blues work together and put their egos aside and group up.

This is not going to work. I think it's just the overall attitude towards UO thats preventing them from doing so. While PVPers always had to generate their own action by actually engaging in combat, trammies and bluebians are used to have things handed to them from Staff (new PVM content, pokemons, you name it) so naturally they'll ask Staff for help everytime something unpredictable (like the rise of EQMS) comes around. This behaviour can also be seen when bluebians ask for petstatloss changes because their beloved meta (pokemon) dragons lose XP after they got PKed, when they want the game to evolve around custom content rather than custom content to evolve around the game.

 

[Lexington]

I guess Im still waiting for someone to explain to me why blues are unable to work together and group up as EQMS has done...

From what I hear here they do. According to some you can't roll solo for fear of being ganked by groups of blues??

Talking about the so called crybaby blue players... what's the motivation for a few Blue "PVM" or even Blue roll playing players to risk fighting reds when they know even if they win the red doesn't receive much as far as punished for his sins?

 

[Weland]

The main reason I put this forward as an idea it gives the Blues a reason to unite and do something. If they do put their egos aside and fight back but are stuck in an endless fight they are going to lose heart and quit.

And it adds a challenge to an overly strong red guild, without punishing the smaller ones.

 

[GluttonySDS]

From what I hear here they do. According to some you can't roll solo for fear of being ganked by groups of blues??

Talking about the so called crybaby blue players... what's the motivation for a few Blue "PVM" or even Blue roll playing players to risk fighting reds when they know even if they win the red doesn't receive much as far as punished for his sins?

If they win, the red logs off for 48hours -- we lost a member to Rekt's group of blues last night and he cant play for 2 days. Meanwhile we killed those blues over and over and each time they died they restocked and came back to fight.

 

[K A Z]

The main reason I put this forward as an idea it gives the Blues a reason to unite and do something. If they do put their egos aside and fight back but are stuck in an endless fight they are going to lose heart and quit.

why in an endless fight? Kids be acting like there is no statloss anymore, which is just simply wrong. Getting your champ done without losing any of the relics/PSs should be ENOUGH of a REWARD, alongside possible GPz made by selling back heads (god forbid, some kids actually still do that). Blues dont need incentives, they need BALLZ. Big, hairy BALLZ.