'Just recall away from reds' is bullshit.

E

eppy

Grandmaster
If you are super worried about it you can make a looping macro in steam that will automate this entirely and recall the instant a red character is seen by your client. Without you even seeing him yourself.
 
Sandman

Sandman

Grandmaster
eppy said:
If you are super worried about it you can make a looping macro in steam that will automate this entirely and recall the instant a red character is seen by your client. Without you even seeing him yourself.
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I feel like this can't be true. The client wouldn't know to see a characters noto status or differentiate the color of their name?
 
wreckognize

wreckognize

Grandmaster
eppy said:
If you are super worried about it you can make a looping macro in steam that will automate this entirely and recall the instant a red character is seen by your client. Without you even seeing him yourself.
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guess you missed the title lol

(yes i'm taking it out of context for trolling purposes)
 
halygon

halygon

Grandmaster
Sandman said:
I feel like this can't be true. The client wouldn't know to see a characters noto status or differentiate the color of their name?
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Of course clients can tell noto of an enemy. Target murderer, Target Innocent, getenemy 'murderer' 'innocent' 'grey' 'humanoid', etc

Razor & UOS know noto
 
MZ3K

MZ3K

Grandmaster
eppy said:
If you are super worried about it you can make a looping macro in steam that will automate this entirely and recall the instant a red character is seen by your client. Without you even seeing him yourself.
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It's not a matter of not-dying. It's a matter of a lack reason to be blue.

If, as you say, the odds favor PKs and PKing is what's exciting about the game. Then there's no reason to not be a PK. As such, the writing is on the wall: without a steady stream of suckers, this rule set will produce an isometric version of Call of Duty.
 
Sandman

Sandman

Grandmaster
MZ3K

Here's an idea. Make a red, try to do whatever it is you were trying to do. I'm assuming farm in a dungeon somewhere. And let me know how there's no reason to not be a PK.

Try to do a champ on a random red bard by yourself. Let me know how that works out bud. You are complaining to just complain at this point.
 
E

eppy

Grandmaster
Some people just aren't into pvp. Myself for example. I'm not good or competitive at it. But damn I still love the rush when I see Wendy whoppers recall in beside me. It makes the game worth playing. There isn't another game I have ever played that can make my heart beat like it does when a red name shows up. That's why I still play.
 
wreckognize

wreckognize

Grandmaster
can we make the message you get when you can't recall due to a murder count after being aggressed:

''Thou has been convicted of a murder, and as such are hereforth unable to recall when attacked! God bless wreckognize - Oh Glory''

??
 
MZ3K

MZ3K

Grandmaster
eppy said:
Some people just aren't into pvp. Myself for example. I'm not good or competitive at it. But damn I still love the rush when I see Wendy whoppers recall in beside me. It makes the game worth playing. There isn't another game I have ever played that can make my heart beat like it does when a red name shows up. That's why I still play.
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Yeah, as I've said, the risk is the reason I opted for UO:F over other options. I like risk. However, in the post of mine that you first replied to, that wasn't my complaint.
 
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Arton

Arton

Neophyte
wreckognize said:
I use one mage to gate my PvMer anywhere he goes. I leave runes on the floor or runebooks so I can easily last target them with last spell, which is gate, so i flip to the mage and do this anytime i see the zerg running on screen. The gate goes right beside my pvmer, and all he has to do is hit one button to use the moongate and go thru. Even taking damage he is normally able to escape.

I also keep another mage online beside the other mage, who is either red or blue, and sometimes even a dexie. He will kill anyone who griefs me and then it only takes 24 hours to burn the murder count if I have to take one.

I also have 2 scribe stun mages, 2 scribe dexies one archer one fencer, that are all pvp capable and able to take murder counts. I also have a stealth mage with alcy for takedowns. and thats outside of the two accounts I use to PvM and gate my PvMer around.

If at any time I get to 0 counts, I will often BPK someone who is an asshole just to keep the murder count timer rolling. This ensures the maximum dominance I can achieve with my toons.

My characters that are my PKs or BPKs also may not be able to recall away from the fight if things go wrong, but I never pack more than 22-33 each reg or basically the minimum of equipment incase I lose. And if I'm farming gold then I will just go thru the gate and put it in the pile very often.
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Thank you for your teachings master Wreck. I shall put it to good use, in time.
 
B

bane

Master
wreckognize said:
Wish it wasn't just my ''agenda'' to make UO:F great again.



lol if it were only a PK problem and not a grief problem then I would support your ideas. But people aren't just PKing anymore, they're griefing like they did to this guy at the bard table. Then once he took a murder count, they came and PK'd him and he couldn't get away.

I used to suport being PKd at the bard table as it was good for game balance. But now with this notoriety griefing going on, it's just leaving new players full of angst the minute they step in the door, destined to become griefers themselves until finally this place becomes a toxic sespool like uoforever was and no reasonable human being would want to play here after taking a look at what the population is like.

And as I've said, I'm not the only veteran UO player here who has witnessed this trend and left. Several vets, even some who coded here, have left because of the community becoming angsty and toxic. It's the same trend we've witnessed as poor game balance and lack of fixes for it destroyed uoforever, ipy2 etc.

We have to promote player enjoyment as its a part of healthy game balance, and the notoriety changes do not accomplish this as they just make things harder for players at the low end of the learning curve.
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See if the griefer is willing to suffer the same restrictions; let them kill your guy macroing then give them a count. Essentially if you aren't ready for PVP don't pvp. Reds gate hopping right after a kill is worse than what we have now. Seriously what did he lose an instrument and some recall regs? Also that murder count will decay in 24 hours so it isn't like
MZ3K said:
That's why I play UO instead of WoW. It's also not what pisses me off. What pisses me off is the unfairness:


1. The PK has all the advantages:
  • Mental preparedness: At the moment of attack, the PK is mentally ready for it; whereas the target is preoccupied with mobs and has to change gears. Some people can switch tasks more easily than others: task switching is an ability. When a PK attacks, only his target is tested on that ability.
  • Pre-buffed: The PK can choose to attack a potential target and so he can choose to do so only if he is fully buffed. In contrast, even if the target has diligently rebuffed himself, if he is fighting mobs, he may not have had time to rebuff when the PK attacks.
  • Full health and mana: The target may have depleted health and mana reserves from fighting mobs; whereas, the PK can choose not to attack if he is in less than the best condition and can choose to attack when the victim's health or mana is depleted.
  • Aggro'd mobs: The target is intentionally seeking out mob-aggro. The PK is not. All other things being equal, the target will have more mob aggro than the PK.
  • Poisoned weapon: The PK can have the advantage of a pre-equipped poison weapon; whereas, the target cannot have that, as the poison would almost certainly be used up on the mobs before a PK were to come around.
2. Consequently, if all contingencies are equal, the PK's attacks only harm his target but never harm the PK:
  • Only the target pays the cost of defeat: The PK has all the advantages, so if all contingencies are equal, then only targets bear the burdens of the defeats that result from PK attacks, and only PKs enjoy the rewards of the victories that result from their attacks.
  • Only the target has to deal with frustration of his plans: The PK has all the advantages, so if all contingencies are equal then the target can only die or successfully flee. In either case the attack frustrates the target's plan to go fight mobs but does not frustrate the PK's plan to go fight players.
3. Fair punishments return equivalent harm to the perpetrator: It's a widely accepted principle of justice that a perpetrator who intentionally damages someone and cannot restore him should have to lose something equivalent to what her victim lost. In other words, an eye for an eye.


4. The current system does not return equivalent harm to PKs:
  • It costs PKs nothing: All of the PKs murders cost his targets something financial. Yet the PK's punishment costs him nothing financial.
  • It frustrates none of the PK's plans: No number of murder counts can affect a character for more than 48 out-of-game hours. During those 48 hours, the PK's stats are temporarily reduced. According to Shane, most PKs have 10+ accounts. Consequently, the PK can burn off that time PKing on an alternate character whose template may be exactly the same as the one burning off the 48 hours, and so the PK may go on doing what he planned to do.
Therefore: the current system is unfair.

While life isn't fair, nobody opts to play an unfair game.
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I only have one counter argument to your well thought out post above otherwise I agree with your other points:

4.1 It costs the PKs nothing:
In response to this I would say losing a character for 2 days is a pretty strong down side if they die. The PKs I know have several reds but they have blue characters since they still craft, do RDA's/Champs on blues, PvM, ..etc. So while they may have 6-7 reds across three accounts they have 7 deaths until they can't play as a red.

While a blue character loses on average 3-10k but can get right back out to farming. I farm a lot on my defense dexxer which is running full invul plate, slayer weapon, and potions. My deaths to PKs cost me about 20k but I end up farming 50-90k in between deaths at a minimum as long as I am on my game. If you are farming as a meta mage or tamer you shouldn't lose more than 3k or so in reagents if you get caught. Hell you can make 20-30k an hour on an incomplete character farming earth elementals so it isn't hard to gear up and end up ahead.

It can be frustrating to die but if you put it in perspective you don't lose much of anything and murder counts will burn off so the recall restriction will not be forever. Now that you know make sure you are willing to accept the inconvenience that comes with having a blue with a murder count.

Reds have an appropriate level of risk currently and without them this game is pretty boring. Balance is what we should strive for.

MZ3K said:
I agree. But winning is more fun than losing, so if the odds are stacked in favor of the PK, we'd all be best to play PKs. Since everyone can be a 7x GM PK within a day, all our characters would be equally capable, and so if we were all to play PKs, then there wouldn't be anything that favorably distinguished UO:F from Call of Duty.
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Seriously take a day and macro up a character to 7x GM to PK. I think this will help you gain some much needed perspective.
 
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