A Way to Make Champ Spawns Great Again

[GluttonySDS]

It seems that there is a decent amount of people who are upset with how champ spawns can sometimes turn out; getting raided at the very end of your champ, dying before the boss dies, and essentially wasting an hour of your time with no reward. While I personally think this is 100% of the game(and my guild does champs, gets raided at champs, and raids others at champs) and you should always be prepared to defend your champ spawn from potential raiders I think a slight modification to the system could be implemented that would make everyone happy.

In addition to the 4 PS and chance for relic/rare drops that come at the end of the champ, people who do champ spawns should accumulate a persistent score for every champ they do(think of something similar to [eventscore for CTFs). Your persistent champ score could eventually be used to cash in for rewards(maybe 105-115 PS, champ rares, other wearables and rares, etc). The idea being that while you and your friends MAY get raided before the boss dies, if that happens, at least you accrued some persistent champ score and put some work in towards eventually cashing these points in for some pixels.

This keeps the people who raid champs happy as the chance for PS and relics at boss end still occurs. This lets the people doing the champ stay happy as if they finish a champ, they can still get the drops AND if they get raided, they havent completely wasted their time.

Thoughts on this proposed system?

 

[Ariakan99]

Sounds good - needs some form of cap to prevent endless farming of lvl 1 at a champ. Also the rewards for persistent score would need to have a limit too - nothing too high.

Adding this also becomes a huge issue for the staff to monitor afk champ score farming, which I think is why it he never been added in the past as a number of versions got suggested. I like that you cannot get top end ps/relics from the event score champ points though.

 

[girana]

Sounds good - needs some form of cap to prevent endless farming of lvl 1 at a champ. Also the rewards for persistent score would need to have a limit too - nothing too high.

Adding this also becomes a huge issue for the staff to monitor afk champ score farming, which I think is why it he never been added in the past as a number of versions got suggested. I like that you cannot get top end ps/relics from the event score champ points though.

ppl would still do just farm score even with a cap.

 

[GluttonySDS]

ppl would still do just farm score even with a cap.

You need 4 people to pop a champ, it cant be popped by yourself... if people want to farm level 1 mobs just to get the capped amount of points towards your champ score, how is this is anymore of a problem of someone who just wants to farm titans?

Agreed on this point though:

• Need to have a cap on the amount of points you can get at low levels of the champ spawn so you cant sit there at level 1 and gain unlimited points.

 

[Young Star]

You only need 3 people if the cooldown has maxed out. 5 people can pop it as early as 4 hours. I dont know the exact window from the earliest till it only takes 3. There is point in between where 4 people can do it. I am thinking the ranging is 1-2 hours.

 

[girana]

You need 4 people to pop a champ, it cant be popped by yourself... if people want to farm level 1 mobs just to get the capped amount of points towards your champ score, how is this is anymore of a problem of someone who just wants to farm titans?

Agreed on this point though:

• Need to have a cap on the amount of points you can get at low levels of the champ spawn so you cant sit there at level 1 and gain unlimited points.

its no problem its just to easy to abuse or useless. How Champscore is working here makes it already very easy to sneak scrolls if you get raided.

 

[GluttonySDS]

How Champscore is working here makes it already very easy to sneak scrolls if you get raided.

I personally think there is no problem with the champ system as it is now but apparently the staff gets a lot of complaint about raids so I thought Id offer this suggestion.

To me, as champs are an end game content, you should be prepared to defend your spawn against potential raiders. I know that everytime EQMS does a champ, we expect to be raided and plan accordingly.

 

[girana]

I personally think there is no problem with the champ system as it is now but apparently the staff gets a lot of complaint about raids so I thought Id offer this suggestion.

this suggestion is very very old and just to easy to abuse it.

 

[GluttonySDS]

this suggestion is very very old and just to easy to abuse it.

How do you abuse it if there are caps to amount of score you can get at each level?

 

[GoD PaRtiCal]

Maybe we should just limit half the PS and all relic drops to the top N% of players based on time spent in champ...

 

[girana]

Maybe we should just limit half the PS and all relic drops to the top N% of players based on time spent in champ...

so everyone just hide chars at champs and get ps/relics into bank ?

 

[GoD PaRtiCal]

so everyone just hide chars at champs and get ps/relics into bank ?

Clearly they would have to contribute and score could weed out the afkers...

 

[halygon]

Please stay on topic, if you have a different suggestion that does not add to the OP, please open your own thread.

On the OP - My concern here is that we are asking for additional rewards. Champ spawns are already fairly lucrative (yes I know the probability of a single player getting something worthwhile is low, I am referring to the economy in general) - adding additional value to them without additional risk may not be the best thing. Reducing the lucrativeness to taking over a champ spawn would accomplish the same while keeping a better balance.

 

[GluttonySDS]

Reducing the lucrativeness to taking over a champ spawn would accomplish the same while keeping a better balance.

Except theres a large amount of risk to taking over a champ spawn... the reward should be commensurate to the risk.

As for increasing the reward of a champ spawn, wheres the harm in having a 2nd system of rewards for a champ spawn based on this global/persistent secondary champ score? Yes, you increase the rewards for doing a champ, but these rewards would be be less lucrative than the chance for a relic or 120 tame and yet would still give those who do a champ but get raided at the end the feeling that they didnt just waste an hour of their time.

 

[MZ3K]

Basically, I like the idea.

It seems that there is a decent amount of people who are upset with how champ spawns can sometimes turn out; getting raided at the very end of your champ, dying before the boss dies, and essentially wasting an hour of your time with no reward.

I agree this is a problem ^^

While I personally think this is 100% of the game

Massive risk is definitely the name of the game. BUT the system is broken no matter how you cut it:

If the result of everyone playing the best strategy in any game is that that game becomes literally impossible to play, then the rules of that game are broken.

In the case of champ spawns, if the name of the game is getting the most for your time, then there's no question that "last minute" raids are the best strategy - but if everyone only attempted last minute raids, then the champ would never get to its last minute.

On the OP - My concern here is that we are asking for additional rewards. Champ spawns are already fairly lucrative (yes I know the probability of a single player getting something worthwhile is low, I am referring to the economy in general) - adding additional value to them without additional risk may not be the best thing. Reducing the lucrativeness to taking over a champ spawn would accomplish the same while keeping a better balance.

The easiest thing to do would be to add in a minimum score required to be eligible for a drop.
You could also make dmg dealt early in a champ give more point per dmg so that the later the raiders arrive, the harder it is for them to reach eligibility threshold.

 

[MZ3K]

@halygon, you could implement @GluttonySDS's idea without adding more to the economy.

Consider that champ/rda rewards are currently obtained much more easily by off-peak players. It's no coincidence that so many of the very-richest players are european players despite the fact that that they comprise so little of the player base. Off-peak players just don't have to deal with the same competition and risk that peak players do, and so they get much more for their time.

You could implement @GluttonySDS's idea without adding more to the economy by reducing the drop chance during off-peak times as needed. This would give both peak and off-peak players the same overall ability to obtain relics and powerscrolls, and fix the problem that the OP wants to solve.

 

[GluttonySDS]

The thing about raiding champs is that it takes a solid group with organization to be able to do it... Im pretty sure EQMS does more champs(i.e. PVEs them from start to finish) and we are rarely raided successfully because people know we are willing to PVP for our champs.

What are you worried about adding to the economy by my system? Just make it so my system is used to get rewards that are comsmetic(clothes, deco, titles, etc..) sort of like how faction rewards are purely cosmetic. This way there is no harm to the PS/RELIC market or economy but there are some nice, non-game changing rewards thrown in for people who champ but dont necessarily get the relic/power scroll drops.

OR

You could work together with your guild/alliance and defend your champ spawns the way end-game content is meant to be handled. No offense @MZ3K but you are in werkt, you shoudl have no excuse for not being able to defend your champ spawn given how large your guild is.

 

[TyroneG]

Just make it so that faction reds can be stat in champ zones by other factioners. Currently there is very little risk to people who raid due to not being able to stat. Usually the only groups organized enough to kill a large group is another group of factioners. It makes absolutely no sense that they are protected against stat (especially in these champ zones/dungeons) against literally the only groups that are consistently capable of killing them..

 

[MZ3K]

You could work together with your guild/alliance and defend your champ spawns the way end-game content is meant to be handled. No offense @MZ3K but you are in werkt, you shoudl have no excuse for not being able to defend your champ spawn given how large your guild is.

No offense taken. I wasn't attempting to excuse anything. I wrote my post with my experiences in other guilds in mind. That said, both my replies argued in favor of what you wrote in your OP.

 

[MZ3K]

Just make it so that faction reds can be stat in champ zones by other factioners. Currently there is very little risk to people who raid due to not being able to stat. Usually the only groups organized enough to kill a large group is another group of factioners. It makes absolutely no sense that they are protected against stat (especially in these champ zones/dungeons) against literally the only groups that are consistently capable of killing them..

+1

I don't think that that would be enough to fix the problem, but if's true that factioners can't cut faction-killed reds in champ spawns (I thought they could be cut in dungeons?), then that would definitely help.