The State of UOF (PKs and purple pots)

[Soul Mate]

No he was a *....................but I do miss him.

You have such a tender heart <3 I kninda miss him too.

 

[Blair]

Firstly, and most importantly, threatening to quit in your opening post for an idea you're suggesting is not a good way to be taken seriously. At all.

I don't think I need to explain why, but I will just so we're both on the same page. Why should we change mechanics to suit you if you're already on the verge of quitting? The changes could force many players to stop playing just so we can placate you. What happens the next time you encounter something you don't like? Would you threaten to quit again if we don't change it? Say we don't change it and you quit. That means we've lost a ton of players from the first change, and you quit anyway because you didn't get what you wanted down the road.

There seems to be a pretty big misconception regarding the role of explosion potions in PvP. You do not need explosion potions to kill people in PvP, I kill people all the time without them, they simply let me do it a little quicker. Just like you don't need to use greater heal potions to survive in PvP, they just make it a little bit easier. If you don't want to use explode pots, that's fine don't use them. Feel free to not use heal pots, cure pots, or refresh pots if you think they're lame as well. For me they're in the game so I'm going to use them, and a ton of other people feel the same way.

Here's an anecdote; I play on my 5x mage with snooping and stealing, I steal all the bandaids and garlic from whoever I'm fighting while healing myself through their alchy dumps or dexer attacks, when they realize they can't heal anymore they run away. The only way I can do damage to them is to use explosion potions, because if I stop to cast a spell they're gone. Even then it takes quite a while to kill them depending on how many heal pots they have because my pots only do 10 damage every 3-4s.

I don't even want to address the idea that people should be forced to stay on screen when they're attacked, so I won't.

The whole notion that there is some lack of diversity of viable PvP builds on this server is, for lack of a better word, insane to me. I've played just about every template you could think of and had success on it, most of them did not have alchemy in the template. Did I use explosion pots on them? I probably did, but I sure as hell used gheal pots too, and cures, and refreshes. I actually used a 600 skill mage recently just for fun to see if I could kill people on it and I could. So in essence if I had taste ID on that character, a taste ID faction mage would be viable.

Now I will address the idea of parry negating explosion potions. This whole idea assumes that there is not enough template diversity, which I've already stated is an insane notion since part of my role as staff on this server is to play new templates all the time and test their viability. It also assumes there is no counter to explosion potions, which we also already know is not true since bandaids and heal potions are the optimal counter, even getting hit by potions that do 20-25 damage every 3-4s your 8s bandage timer will heal enough in that time and you could use a heal pot as well to heal damage from other sources. So then we say let's make parry also counter explode pots, even though dexers already have the counter in their kit, let's give them something else as well. Alright so I'm not sure if you've ever fought against a parry dexer while also playing a dexer, but it's virtually impossible to kill them unless they disconnect or run out of bandages even if you're using explode pots to kill them. So dexers can't kill other parry dexers since explode pots don't work against parry, let's look at what would happen vs a mage. So a mage would have to do 120 damage in 9s to kill me. I have 120 hits because I'm always fully strengthed (pots are in the game I'm gonna use them). I run balanced stats so my bandage timer is 9s instead of 8s, but mindblast only does 12 damage to me. Since parry negates explode pots the mage will be missing 40-50 damage in that 9s window. Explode and energy bolt do max 33 damage, and cost 20 mana. Even if I didn't resist anything, and there were max rolls on damage, and I didn't run off screen it would take 80 mana to deliver enough damage to potentially kill me, which I probably wouldn't even die to since I'd use a heal pot. Basically it would come down to the fact that if I made the mage cast 1 gheal on himself he wouldn't have enough mana to kill me ever. So other dexers couldn't kill a parry dexer, mages wouldn't be able to kill a parry dexer... so why would anyone play anything but a parry dexer? How would this promote diversity in templates? It wouldn't.

So when players PvP a lot and don't agree with your ideas it's not personal, they can objectively look at how things would play out because they understand the damage required to kill another competent player. Most esport games balance around the professional play anyway, not around the people who admittedly don't participate very often.

@Winstonian

 

[Soul Mate]

I thought the parrying idea wasn't totally terrible, but... the sad fact is that purple pots should be left alone, because if they're touched it will set off a great wailing and gnashing of teeth about bandages and mini heal etc, and if those get nerfed it will drive away PvMers who make up the bulk of the playerbase, which will set off another round of reactive nerfing (LJ, maybe?) and on and on ad infinitum.

How about we declare a moratorium on all these "please nerf my enemies" campaigns and just call it good?

Get used to the crying, it has been going on since 1997...ON BOTH sides. I can clearly see the bullshit from both sides most likely because I do not let emotional involvement color my perception. Anyway UO addicts always cry...and cry they will leave,yet never do.

 

[EvilAcid]

Hi friends. Just a quickie for kaz. You implied trammy's earlier. Just stick to your points without using the dreaded T word please. Some of us are the farthest thing from that. I have highlighted this in other threads. And second. I was honestly curious if many people here have played later versions of uo after all the skill additions and weapon abilities? Not even trying to fight for them to be implimented obviously. I personally thought it made uo way more fun than i had pre trammel days. Ok cheers.

 

[Soul Mate]

Absolutely.

Forcing mages to choose between stun, heal, alch, scribe or poison (which needs a buff) as viable build options would be perfect for this game, and that's how it should be. Parry dexers would get a huge, much needed boost in popularity.

Right now, most mages have stun and throw expl pots. It's... just... really not the way I feel UO PvP should be.

Poison is never going to get any love....I waited a long time for nothing

 

[EvilAcid]

Pardon malk made reference to my question a little bit. I would call uof a great server, but nothing close to an era accurate one. Lots of custom content and tweaks. Which is great. I just was curious if people have seen the difference and their insight into it.

 

[Soul Mate]

Good. Then make purple pots splash and hit innocents and I'm on board. You want era accurate? Give me era accurate. Thst way, pots would disappear completely in most places. My suggestion is keeping them in the game and adding validity to a skill rarely used in PvP.

Dude you are fucked either way....People will cry and say hey, this is NOT OLD SKOOL UO GET USED TO IT! or they will say HEY IF YOU WANT AOS GO SOMEWHERE else...so you will never win ..damned if you do damned if you don't

It all depends how they are feeling that day and if it Affects their style of play.

 

[Bongzilla]

I used to hate purples but it doesn't really matter if you have healing. Shit I'm even throwing a few here and there. *i suck at pot chucking* then again I don't use hacked out clients and I do most of my shit by hand.

 

[lollo]

Firstly, and most importantly, threatening to quit in your opening post for an idea you're suggesting is not a good way to be taken seriously. At all.

I don't think I need to explain why, but I will just so we're both on the same page. Why should we change mechanics to suit you if you're already on the verge of quitting? The changes could force many players to stop playing just so we can placate you. What happens the next time you encounter something you don't like? Would you threaten to quit again if we don't change it? Say we don't change it and you quit. That means we've lost a ton of players from the first change, and you quit anyway because you didn't get what you wanted down the road.

There seems to be a pretty big misconception regarding the role of explosion potions in PvP. You do not need explosion potions to kill people in PvP, I kill people all the time without them, they simply let me do it a little quicker. Just like you don't need to use greater heal potions to survive in PvP, they just make it a little bit easier. If you don't want to use explode pots, that's fine don't use them. Feel free to not use heal pots, cure pots, or refresh pots if you think they're lame as well. For me they're in the game so I'm going to use them, and a ton of other people feel the same way.

Here's an anecdote; I play on my 5x mage with snooping and stealing, I steal all the bandaids and garlic from whoever I'm fighting while healing myself through their alchy dumps or dexer attacks, when they realize they can't heal anymore they run away. The only way I can do damage to them is to use explosion potions, because if I stop to cast a spell they're gone. Even then it takes quite a while to kill them depending on how many heal pots they have because my pots only do 10 damage every 3-4s.

I don't even want to address the idea that people should be forced to stay on screen when they're attacked, so I won't.

The whole notion that there is some lack of diversity of viable PvP builds on this server is, for lack of a better word, insane to me. I've played just about every template you could think of and had success on it, most of them did not have alchemy in the template. Did I use explosion pots on them? I probably did, but I sure as hell used gheal pots too, and cures, and refreshes. I actually used a 600 skill mage recently just for fun to see if I could kill people on it and I could. So in essence if I had taste ID on that character, a taste ID faction mage would be viable.

Now I will address the idea of parry negating explosion potions. This whole idea assumes that there is not enough template diversity, which I've already stated is an insane notion since part of my role as staff on this server is to play new templates all the time and test their viability. It also assumes there is no counter to explosion potions, which we also already know is not true since bandaids and heal potions are the optimal counter, even getting hit by potions that do 20-25 damage every 3-4s your 8s bandage timer will heal enough in that time and you could use a heal pot as well to heal damage from other sources. So then we say let's make parry also counter explode pots, even though dexers already have the counter in their kit, let's give them something else as well. Alright so I'm not sure if you've ever fought against a parry dexer while also playing a dexer, but it's virtually impossible to kill them unless they disconnect or run out of bandages even if you're using explode pots to kill them. So dexers can't kill other parry dexers since explode pots don't work against parry, let's look at what would happen vs a mage. So a mage would have to do 120 damage in 9s to kill me. I have 120 hits because I'm always fully strengthed (pots are in the game I'm gonna use them). I run balanced stats so my bandage timer is 9s instead of 8s, but mindblast only does 12 damage to me. Since parry negates explode pots the mage will be missing 40-50 damage in that 9s window. Explode and energy bolt do max 33 damage, and cost 20 mana. Even if I didn't resist anything, and there were max rolls on damage, and I didn't run off screen it would take 80 mana to deliver enough damage to potentially kill me, which I probably wouldn't even die to since I'd use a heal pot. Basically it would come down to the fact that if I made the mage cast 1 gheal on himself he wouldn't have enough mana to kill me ever. So other dexers couldn't kill a parry dexer, mages wouldn't be able to kill a parry dexer... so why would anyone play anything but a parry dexer? How would this promote diversity in templates? It wouldn't.

So when players PvP a lot and don't agree with your ideas it's not personal, they can objectively look at how things would play out because they understand the damage required to kill another competent player. Most esport games balance around the professional play anyway, not around the people who admittedly don't participate very often.

@Winstonian

Quoted for truth, just so @Winstonian can read it one more time

 

[smile it's me]

Firstly, and most importantly, threatening to quit in your opening post for an idea you're suggesting is not a good way to be taken seriously. At all.

I don't think I need to explain why, but I will just so we're both on the same page. Why should we change mechanics to suit you if you're already on the verge of quitting? The changes could force many players to stop playing just so we can placate you. What happens the next time you encounter something you don't like? Would you threaten to quit again if we don't change it? Say we don't change it and you quit. That means we've lost a ton of players from the first change, and you quit anyway because you didn't get what you wanted down the road.

There seems to be a pretty big misconception regarding the role of explosion potions in PvP. You do not need explosion potions to kill people in PvP, I kill people all the time without them, they simply let me do it a little quicker. Just like you don't need to use greater heal potions to survive in PvP, they just make it a little bit easier. If you don't want to use explode pots, that's fine don't use them. Feel free to not use heal pots, cure pots, or refresh pots if you think they're lame as well. For me they're in the game so I'm going to use them, and a ton of other people feel the same way.

Here's an anecdote; I play on my 5x mage with snooping and stealing, I steal all the bandaids and garlic from whoever I'm fighting while healing myself through their alchy dumps or dexer attacks, when they realize they can't heal anymore they run away. The only way I can do damage to them is to use explosion potions, because if I stop to cast a spell they're gone. Even then it takes quite a while to kill them depending on how many heal pots they have because my pots only do 10 damage every 3-4s.

I don't even want to address the idea that people should be forced to stay on screen when they're attacked, so I won't.

The whole notion that there is some lack of diversity of viable PvP builds on this server is, for lack of a better word, insane to me. I've played just about every template you could think of and had success on it, most of them did not have alchemy in the template. Did I use explosion pots on them? I probably did, but I sure as hell used gheal pots too, and cures, and refreshes. I actually used a 600 skill mage recently just for fun to see if I could kill people on it and I could. So in essence if I had taste ID on that character, a taste ID faction mage would be viable.

Now I will address the idea of parry negating explosion potions. This whole idea assumes that there is not enough template diversity, which I've already stated is an insane notion since part of my role as staff on this server is to play new templates all the time and test their viability. It also assumes there is no counter to explosion potions, which we also already know is not true since bandaids and heal potions are the optimal counter, even getting hit by potions that do 20-25 damage every 3-4s your 8s bandage timer will heal enough in that time and you could use a heal pot as well to heal damage from other sources. So then we say let's make parry also counter explode pots, even though dexers already have the counter in their kit, let's give them something else as well. Alright so I'm not sure if you've ever fought against a parry dexer while also playing a dexer, but it's virtually impossible to kill them unless they disconnect or run out of bandages even if you're using explode pots to kill them. So dexers can't kill other parry dexers since explode pots don't work against parry, let's look at what would happen vs a mage. So a mage would have to do 120 damage in 9s to kill me. I have 120 hits because I'm always fully strengthed (pots are in the game I'm gonna use them). I run balanced stats so my bandage timer is 9s instead of 8s, but mindblast only does 12 damage to me. Since parry negates explode pots the mage will be missing 40-50 damage in that 9s window. Explode and energy bolt do max 33 damage, and cost 20 mana. Even if I didn't resist anything, and there were max rolls on damage, and I didn't run off screen it would take 80 mana to deliver enough damage to potentially kill me, which I probably wouldn't even die to since I'd use a heal pot. Basically it would come down to the fact that if I made the mage cast 1 gheal on himself he wouldn't have enough mana to kill me ever. So other dexers couldn't kill a parry dexer, mages wouldn't be able to kill a parry dexer... so why would anyone play anything but a parry dexer? How would this promote diversity in templates? It wouldn't.

So when players PvP a lot and don't agree with your ideas it's not personal, they can objectively look at how things would play out because they understand the damage required to kill another competent player. Most esport games balance around the professional play anyway, not around the people who admittedly don't participate very often.

@Winstonian

 

[smile it's me]

however the Blair's post implies that in a scenario one on one , one of the two must die.
big mistake.
for me one of the beautiful things of UO was able to escape successfully from a fight.

 

[lollo]

however the Blair's post implies that in a scenario one on one , one of the two must die.
big mistake.
for me one of the beautiful things of UO was able to escape successfully from a fight.

It's already super easy to escape an 1v1 in UOF, are we playing the same game? Like did you EVER die in a 1v1 pvp scenario where you chose to just run away and not fight? (talking about a pvp character, not getting pkd on a bard or something)

 

[smile it's me]

I am already used to this style of play. I just recall away. but it is not fun for the prey/predator.

 

[lollo]

I am already used to this style of play. I just recall away. but it is not fun for the prey/predator.

I'm not talking about recalling away, just run (forever)

 

[Winstonian]

Firstly, and most importantly, threatening to quit in your opening post for an idea you're suggesting is not a good way to be taken seriously. At all.

I don't think I need to explain why, but I will just so we're both on the same page. Why should we change mechanics to suit you if you're already on the verge of quitting? The changes could force many players to stop playing just so we can placate you. What happens the next time you encounter something you don't like? Would you threaten to quit again if we don't change it? Say we don't change it and you quit. That means we've lost a ton of players from the first change, and you quit anyway because you didn't get what you wanted down the road.

There seems to be a pretty big misconception regarding the role of explosion potions in PvP. You do not need explosion potions to kill people in PvP, I kill people all the time without them, they simply let me do it a little quicker. Just like you don't need to use greater heal potions to survive in PvP, they just make it a little bit easier. If you don't want to use explode pots, that's fine don't use them. Feel free to not use heal pots, cure pots, or refresh pots if you think they're lame as well. For me they're in the game so I'm going to use them, and a ton of other people feel the same way.

Here's an anecdote; I play on my 5x mage with snooping and stealing, I steal all the bandaids and garlic from whoever I'm fighting while healing myself through their alchy dumps or dexer attacks, when they realize they can't heal anymore they run away. The only way I can do damage to them is to use explosion potions, because if I stop to cast a spell they're gone. Even then it takes quite a while to kill them depending on how many heal pots they have because my pots only do 10 damage every 3-4s.

I don't even want to address the idea that people should be forced to stay on screen when they're attacked, so I won't.

The whole notion that there is some lack of diversity of viable PvP builds on this server is, for lack of a better word, insane to me. I've played just about every template you could think of and had success on it, most of them did not have alchemy in the template. Did I use explosion pots on them? I probably did, but I sure as hell used gheal pots too, and cures, and refreshes. I actually used a 600 skill mage recently just for fun to see if I could kill people on it and I could. So in essence if I had taste ID on that character, a taste ID faction mage would be viable.

Now I will address the idea of parry negating explosion potions. This whole idea assumes that there is not enough template diversity, which I've already stated is an insane notion since part of my role as staff on this server is to play new templates all the time and test their viability. It also assumes there is no counter to explosion potions, which we also already know is not true since bandaids and heal potions are the optimal counter, even getting hit by potions that do 20-25 damage every 3-4s your 8s bandage timer will heal enough in that time and you could use a heal pot as well to heal damage from other sources. So then we say let's make parry also counter explode pots, even though dexers already have the counter in their kit, let's give them something else as well. Alright so I'm not sure if you've ever fought against a parry dexer while also playing a dexer, but it's virtually impossible to kill them unless they disconnect or run out of bandages even if you're using explode pots to kill them. So dexers can't kill other parry dexers since explode pots don't work against parry, let's look at what would happen vs a mage. So a mage would have to do 120 damage in 9s to kill me. I have 120 hits because I'm always fully strengthed (pots are in the game I'm gonna use them). I run balanced stats so my bandage timer is 9s instead of 8s, but mindblast only does 12 damage to me. Since parry negates explode pots the mage will be missing 40-50 damage in that 9s window. Explode and energy bolt do max 33 damage, and cost 20 mana. Even if I didn't resist anything, and there were max rolls on damage, and I didn't run off screen it would take 80 mana to deliver enough damage to potentially kill me, which I probably wouldn't even die to since I'd use a heal pot. Basically it would come down to the fact that if I made the mage cast 1 gheal on himself he wouldn't have enough mana to kill me ever. So other dexers couldn't kill a parry dexer, mages wouldn't be able to kill a parry dexer... so why would anyone play anything but a parry dexer? How would this promote diversity in templates? It wouldn't.

So when players PvP a lot and don't agree with your ideas it's not personal, they can objectively look at how things would play out because they understand the damage required to kill another competent player. Most esport games balance around the professional play anyway, not around the people who admittedly don't participate very often.

@Winstonian

Thanks for taking the time to respond.

Why change the mechanics for me? Easy answer: It's clearly not just me. My suggestion was just that: a suggestion. It being a bad suggestion to some doesn't mean that the system shouldn't be modified or improved. Many see something wrong with the expl pot reliance and mechanics on this server. They don't PvP (here) because they don't like the mechanics, then they're requests for change are ignored because they don't PvP. Those go hand in hand.

Hell, your 'leet PvPers' are the ones arguing that expl pots are needed to kill anyone. You might want to have that argument with them, not me.

K A Z himself is begging for significant changes to UOF PvP, including expl pots. I'm guessing that means you're taking his list of demands seriously?

Just because YOU have played every PvP build imaginable doesn't mean that there's actual build diversity on display on a daily basis. There isn't. As one of your PvPers said: every single mage who PvPs is running stun and throwing expl pots. Every single one. If you don't think that that's an issue, then it speaks volumes about the PvP on this shard.

But, of course, the purpose of my OP was to see where the staff stands on UOF PvP. If the staff feels that things are great the way they are; awesome. Great to hear. There are some that enjoy it, so it works. Why would someone looking for PvP play on a shard where they don't enjoy the PvP mechanics? Where those mechanics vary greatly from the era of UO the shard is labeled to represent? "Yeah, I hate the PvP here. I'll happily invest the next 3 years of my life doing something I don't enjoy with the minimal free time I have, knowing that the staff has no interest or desire to tweak and modify the way things are."

My questions were clear. You seem to have (indirectly) answered them. Great, sounds good. Thanks for your time.

 

[lollo]

Thanks for taking the time to respond.

Why change the mechanics for me? Easy answer: It's clearly not just me. My suggestion was just that: a suggestion. It being a bad suggestion to some doesn't mean that the system shouldn't be modified or improved. Many see something wrong with the expl pot reliance and mechanics on this server. They don't PvP (here) because they don't like the mechanics, then they're requests for change are ignored because they don't PvP. Those go hand in hand.

Hell, your 'leet PvPers' are the ones arguing that expl pots are needed to kill anyone. You might want to have that argument with them, not me.

K A Z himself is begging for significant changes to UOF PvP, including expl pots. I'm guessing that means you're taking his list of demands seriously?

Just because YOU have played every PvP build imaginable doesn't mean that there's actual build diversity on display on a daily basis. There isn't. As one of your PvPers said: every single mage who PvPs is running stun and throwing expl pots. Every single one. If you don't think that that's an issue, then it speaks volumes about the PvP on this shard.

But, of course, the purpose of my OP was to see where the staff stands on UOF PvP. If the staff feels that things are great the way they are; awesome. Great to hear. There are some that enjoy it, so it works. Why would someone looking for PvP play on a shard where they don't enjoy the PvP mechanics? Where those mechanics vary greatly from the era of UO the shard is labeled to represent? "Yeah, I hate the PvP here. I'll happily invest the next 3 years of my life doing something I don't enjoy with the minimal free time I have, knowing that the staff has no interest or desire to tweak and modify the way things are."

My questions were clear. You seem to have (indirectly) answered them. Great, sounds good. Thanks for your time.

People don't pvp because they don't like dying. It's as simple as that. You could tweak pvp and make it as user friendly as possibile, with rainbox shaped ebolts, and 90% of the server wouldn't pvp anyways, because they don't want to die to the 10% that actually has some pvp skills.

Anyways, you and your suggestions will (not) be missed. Bye and have fun in your future adventures

 

[Winstonian]

People don't pvp because they don't like dying. It's as simple as that. You could tweak pvp and make it as user friendly as possibile, with rainbox shaped ebolts, and 90% of the server wouldn't pvp anyways, because they don't want to die to the 10% that actually has some pvp skills.

Anyways, you and your suggestions will (not) be missed. Bye and have fun in your future adventures

That's not true for all of them... not even close. If players didn't want to die, they'd go play elsewhere.

Many have said - in this thread - that they don't like the PvP mechanics here. I bet a lot more of the population would join in if things were tweaked. (Then again, the cheating in an 18 year old wizard game is also a deterrent.)

 

[lollo]

That's not true for all of them... not even close. If players didn't want to die, they'd go play elsewhere.

Many have said - in this thread - that they don't like the PvP mechanics here. I bet a lot more of the population would join in if things were tweaked. (Then again, the cheating in an 18 year old wizard game is also a deterrent.)

I guess we have to agree to disagree.

 

[stunoma.]

I don't understand the problem here. Anyone is allowed to use Purple pots. You don't need purples to pvp. You don't need alchemy to throw purple pots it'll just do a bit more damage with it. People are complaining because they refuse to learn how to throw them. The pros use them with all templates because who wouldn't use an extra bit of damage . But overall you don't need them to pvp. It'll simply make things easier.

Like how can you complain about something offered to everyone .

I don't use them and too lazy to properly learn/definitely not using some gay script passed around

That being said, I still pvp

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Darkarna]

People don't pvp because they don't like dying. It's as simple as that. You could tweak pvp and make it as user friendly as possibile, with rainbox shaped ebolts, and 90% of the server wouldn't pvp anyways, because they don't want to die to the 10% that actually has some pvp skills.

Anyways, you and your suggestions will (not) be missed. Bye and have fun in your future adventures

I guess we have to agree to disagree.

Why would people play on a Felucia based rule-set if they don't want to die? Surely those people would choose a different server using nothing but Trammel rule sets. The mind boggles at the clear stupidity that can be found on occasion around here.

DUH, AYE PWAY AH FOOLUCIAN WULESET CUZZ EYE DUNT WUNT TUUU DYE!

Honestly, it really sounds like that sometimes..