Non-Leather Armor AR vs. Dex-Loss Information/Suggestion/Discussion Thread

[TyraeL!]

HAIL AND WELL MET!!

So, I have noticed that MOST armor, as in, the majority of it, is....I don't want to say worthless, but just ignored and/or seldom used when compared to others (leather/studded leather - even for dexxers). I was going to go on a bit of a diatribe about which armors are super fucked regarding AR:dex loss ratio and all that but I decided against that and would rather just present the facts with a modest amount of personal opinion and let the rest of you chime in.

I'd like this thread to not only be geared towards discussion of the subject at hand but also a breeding ground for possible ideas/outcomes that will benefit the shard and the staff (take a little weight off their shoulders) and help round out this aspect of game play.

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CAVEATS:

-I'm aware that the current dex loss might technically be era-accurate, but clearly there are some issues with comparable AR between armor types vs. dex loss that need to be addressed. This is a server with a plethora of various customizations/mods so it's not as if this would be unheard of or inappropriate.

-We all have our own opinions, much like assholes, and they all stink, sure. Some of us who play dexxers more would be more inclined to want less dex loss in general while those who primarily play leather-wearing magi would prefer the dex loss remain the same or perhaps be more severe. Try and keep it unbiased and take into consideration the facts presented before you.

-MOST of the magic armor I wore to compile the following information was repaired to full beforehand, but others might not have been 100% unused, so there are a few small discrepancies between some of the AR listings, which are negligible (1-2 AR). It all scales quite similarly so you will get the picture. All of the exceptional gear was made immediately before wearing it and was 100% unused.

-Also, when considering the dex loss of certain armor types, let us ONLY CONSIDER the armor types and their AR/dex loss, meaning, use of agility potions or bless spells, for instance, shouldn't be thrown into the mix as it doesn't actually have a damn thing to do with the subject matter.

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DATA:

The following is a list of all exceptional armors (metal/bone/leather, with the exception of spined/horned/barbed bone armor, because no one ever wears that, ever, for practical purposes - which I'd like to change) and their AR/dex loss, as well as a set of each popular metal/leather/bone armor suits of the fortification and invulnerability variety.

Yes, certain combinations have been omitted from my research because frankly, it just wasn't necessary and also because there's a ton of random combinations. I merely went with the more historically popular 6-piece sets. I also chose to omit any magic armor below fortification because as common as magic armor is, it's silly to wear anything less unless you're a nib nob. If there's enough genuine want/need to try other armors for comparative purposes, I will do so. The dex loss becomes a bit more justified with some of the magic armor but it just isn't as applicable since most of the time (THOUGH NOT ALL) you'll be going up against some sort of mage. With as many dexxers I've seen out and about, I've seen a shockingly low amount of plate or chain, or even ring being worn. Yes, some people use it (myself included, at times) but the proof is in the pudding.

Bone armor, for example, has always been (on the majority of shards) a go-to suit for dexxers because it yielded great AR and little to no dex loss. It's biggest downside was that it was fragile and not repairable. Working your way to the metal armors, platemail was always reserved for the true tanks, while chainmail and ringmail were worn to provide solid AR but not so much dex loss, making you still very potent with whatever weapon. The fact that a fairly standard chainmail set yields the same dex loss as a bone armor set with only a slight bump in AR, is one such issue I was hoping to raise with this thread. Additionally, as you will see below, there are some dangerously close values in AR between certain sets/types of armor that more or less make 1 or more somewhat comparable armors obsolete.


EXCEPTIONAL GEAR:

Regular Leather - 15 AR, 0 dex, meddable
Spined Leather - 25 AR, 0 dex, meddable
Horned Leather - 28 AR, 0 dex, meddable
Barbed Leather - 31 AR, 0 dex, meddable

Regular Studded Leather - 19 AR, 0 dex, non-meddable (with norse helm, +2 AR)
Spined Studded Leather - 28 AR, 0 dex, non-meddable
Horned Studded Leather - 32 AR, 0 dex, non-meddable
Barbed Studded Leather - 34 AR, 0 dex, non-meddable

Ringmail + Plate Gorget/Norse Helm - 29 AR, -6 dex, non-meddable
Chainmail + Plate Gorget/Ring Sleeves/Ring Gloves - 32 AR, -14 dex, non-meddable
Bone Armor + Plate Gorget - 37 AR, -14 dex, non-meddable
Platemail + Norse Helm - 47 AR, -20 dex, non-meddable (with plate helm, another -5 dex, ~ +2 AR)

RUNIC LEATHER:

Spined Leather - 43 AR, 0 dex, meddable
Spined Studded Leather - 46 AR, 0 dex, non-meddable
Horned Leather - 52 AR, 0 dex, meddable
Horned Studded Leather - 56 AR, 0 dex, non-meddable

FORTIFICATION GEAR:

Regular Leather - 43 AR, 0 dex, meddable
Studded Leather - 45 AR, 0 dex, non-meddable (with norse helm, +3 AR)
Ringmail + Plate Gorget/Norse Helm - 54 AR, -6 dex, non-meddable
Chainmail + Plate Gorget/Ring Sleeves/Ring Gloves - 57 AR, -14 dex, non-meddable
Bone Armor + Plate Gorget - 60 AR, -14 dex, non-meddable
Platemail + Norse Helm - 68 AR, -20 dex, non-meddable (with plate helm, another -5 dex, ~ +2 AR)

INVULNERABILITY GEAR:

Regular Leather - 48 AR, 0 dex, meddable
Studded Leather - 50 AR, 0 dex, non-meddable
Ringmail + Plate Gorget/Norse Helm - 56 AR, -6 dex, non-meddable
Chainmail + Plate Gorget/Ring Sleeves/Ring Gloves - 61 AR, -14 dex, non-meddable
Bone Armor + Plate Gorget - 65 AR, -14 dex, non-meddable
Platemail + Norse Helm - 73 AR, -20 dex, non-meddable (with plate helm, another -5 dex, ~ +2 AR)


EDIT:
Added two runic leathers. Yea, runic leather armors are kind of badass. I think they should remain uncommon/rare-ish. I guess I expected there to be a bigger margin between leather armor and studded than the 3-4 AR, but at least it's all consistent.

This took longer than I expected to compile and post because I had to do it in chunks due to IRL interruptions, so at this point I don't feel like adding anything else to the mix. Let's just get to it.

Oh, then there's this silliness that is a semi-related bit that should be addressed at some point:

 

[TyraeL!]

I think the fact that the donation bong thread is getting 20 billion more hits than this, speaks for itself....one of these days we'll address actual issues rather than what's next on the goddamn dono vendor.

 

[phantomrash]

Ive been thinking about the dex loss myself and feel that it has made chain and plate kind of obsolete. Regular gm chain offers little more AR than barbed studded, and who goes for ogre lords anymore anyway?. On the plus side, it makes you think about your armor combo and offers more of a variation in dex suits. I think the ringmail tunic w/ dragon gorget with studded everything else will be the new dex suit.

 

[Stratios]

I can't speak for the other suits, but chainmail could use a little bit of a buff. I feel like I'm only wearing it now out of habit. This information makes me want to switch to studded leather/ringmail on my dexxer.

 

[Staff]

Some changes shall be incoming.

 

[jeffe]

I understand that it would have taken a lot of time and resources to provide results for AR made from different ore, but they certainly play into this discussion.

For me, the tunic and leg pieces of anything higher than ring mail penalize dex too much for the AR provided to be useful. Especially, with how little protection AR gives in the first place.

Furthermore (and imo), a warrior/dexxer should be able to tank most high-end mobs. Currently, we are forced to tank with dragons or beetles. There's not enough damage mitigation that we have as players to allow even a large group to tank even the simplest of bosses without tamers.

If UOF is forging ahead to a 'New Age' show some love for warrior tanks. Give parry some damage mitigation buffs while limiting a tank's DPS output (this would be akin to a kind of 'Defensive Stance' where perhaps a large bonus to str/hp is given while dex/stam is reduced by 50 or 75%). There certainly has to be a trade off in regards to a dexxor being able to tank and do insane amounts of DPS (dexxor + slayer weapon = highest DPS in game to a single mob).

 

[Staff]

Regarding the shields, that is how they are supposed to be. They show their full AR value in the window there. However, it isn't applied every hit (like armor). A shields AR is only taken into account when you successfully parry a blow.

Also regarding parry, we have 100% damage mitigation in on something like a 15 percent chance at GM. This is an AOS feature. Parry shouldn't be weak.

 

[halygon]

@TyraeL! - Wheres the Runic armor?

 

[TyraeL!]

@TyraeL! - Wheres the Runic armor?

!¡!¡!¡

Being that it isn't all that practical, due to its expensiveness and uncommon/rare nature, it didn't seem necessary but I can make some spined/horned runic suits for comparison purposes. It's badass AR, and because I can, I already made some horned runic slayer armor!¡!¡

 

[halygon]

!¡!¡!¡

Being that it isn't all that practical, due to its expensiveness and uncommon/rare nature, it didn't seem necessary but I can make some spined/horned runic suits for comparison purposes. It's badass AR, and because I can, I already made some horned runic slayer armor!¡!¡

I pretty much never run in anything less than spined runic studded armor. I think a bunch of other guys do too.

 

[TyraeL!]

I pretty much never run in anything less than spined runic studded armor. I think a bunch of other guys do too.

I just never see that, which leads me to believe a few might, sure, but a "bunch" seems unlikely regardless of one's interpretation of the word.

Hell, horned seems more common. I know I have more of those kits than spined.

If magics were much less common I think many would, but it's just too damn easy to throw a fortification suit or invuln suit together.

 

[halygon]

I just never see that, which leads me to believe a few might, sure, but a "bunch" seems unlikely regardless of one's interpretation of the word.

Hell, horned seems more common. I know I have more of those kits than spined.

If magics were much less common I think many would, but it's just too damn easy to throw a fortification suit or invuln suit together.

True, there are a lot of magic armor sets out there.

 

[NoXXeD]

True, there are a lot of magic armor sets out there.

see and that's the issue. I have a few sets off fort and invul iron and bone armor...useless now due to the dex penalties...

 

[TyraeL!]

I added spined leather/studded leather and horned leather/studded leather to the list.

DON'T FORGET TO VOTE AT THE TOP!!

 

[Shane]

Yeah dexers are getting some SERIOUS love in the expansion. Calm your tid-bits.

 

[NoXXeD]

Yeah dexers are getting some SERIOUS love in the expansion. Calm your tid-bits.

give us some hints?

 

[Shane]

give us some hints?

come on my man.
We are days away from it.

 

[NoXXeD]

come on my man.
We are days away from it.

Hey, it don't hurt to try right? After all it is about to be xmas!!!!

 

[halygon]

I added spined leather/studded leather and horned leather/studded leather to the list.

DON'T FORGET TO VOTE AT THE TOP!!

Although super rare, here are the numbers for barbed runic:

Barbed Runic Leather Armor- 62 AR | 0 dex loss | medable

Barbed Runic Studded Leather Armor - 66 AR (68 AR with barbed runic bone helmet) | 0 dex loss | non-medable

 

[phantomrash]

I think this discussion leaves out the fact that a ton of players might not even know what runic armor is or how to obtain it. Halygon says he doesnt see anything but runic armor? well ive never even had a suit in the 1 year ive been playing. Granted I'd consider myself a noob still, but I feel i represent a large portion of the community of players who enjoy the game yet are not super leet, running vendor malls and stuff.