New hit chance mechanics for PvP - Capped # of hits or misses

[wreckognize]

Basically the idea here is to eliminate long streaks of hits or misses which are causing a significant number of the playerbase frustration.

The idea is that if you are holding a 2 handed weapon, then you will automatically hit after 2 misses in a row, or vice versa, you will automatically miss if you hit twice in a row.

With one handed weapons this changes to an automatic hit every 3 misses in a row, or vice versa, an automatic miss every 3 hits in a row.

Now if say you were holding a 2 handed weapon, and hit twice in a row, you may not want to miss that third time, so what you can do is switch to a 1 hander. In place of an automatic miss, your swing timer is simply reset.

Personally I feel as though this may really be the once-and-for-all way to balance mages and townfighters in Ultima Online.

Thoughts?

EDIT* this is not exploitable because you can simply put a short cooldown on an automatic hit of like 5 seconds so that you can't prep an automatic hit by sparring with a friend before going out to fight.

 

[GluttonySDS]

mages and "townies" are already balanced... in smaller groups or 1v1 dexxers dominate mages, in large groups, mages dominate dexxers.

 

[Deadpool]

+ 1

 

[wreckognize]

mages and "townies" are already balanced... in smaller groups or 1v1 dexxers dominate mages, in large groups, mages dominate dexxers.

Regardless of your opinion on the state of balance between the two classes, which I disagree with, I still feel this would be a better, less frustrating balance for both classes.

 

[Winstonian]

Not sure I agree with the guaranteed hit, or guaranteed miss... and I think it's a concept that could actually hurt dexers in PvP. Instead, slower weapons simply need to hit more often. Fast weapons are fine as they are.

 

[Elizabeth Gold]

Not sure I agree with the guaranteed hit, or guaranteed miss... and I think it's a concept that could actually hurt dexers in PvP. Instead, slower weapons simply need to hit more often. Fast weapons are fine as they are.

If you compare weapons, you see that slower weapons do less damage over time, but have a higher alpha damage.
If you implement a guarantied hit system, you can 'prepare' it by sparring with a buddy.

Now combine those two factors and you get this:
Player 1: Guarantied spear hit + paralizing blow on player 2.
Player 2: Paralized for 3 seconds.
Player 1: Gets one more swing (50% change) at player 2.

Now lets say player 1 comes with buddy 1:
Player 1: Guarantied spear hit + paralizing blow on player 2.
Buddy 1: Guarantied doubleaxe hit on player 2.
Player 2: Paralized for 3 seconds.
Player 1: Gets one more swing (50% change) at player 2.
Buddy 1: Gets one more swing (50% change) at player 2.

That would create some serious opening damage without the ability to react from player 2.

 

[wreckognize]

If you compare weapons, you see that slower weapons do less damage over time, but have a higher alpha damage.
If you implement a guarantied hit system, you can 'prepare' it by sparring with a buddy.

Now combine those two factors and you get this:
Player 1: Guarantied spear hit + paralizing blow on player 2.
Player 2: Paralized for 3 seconds.
Player 1: Gets one more swing (50% change) at player 2.

Now lets say player 1 comes with buddy 1:
Player 1: Guarantied spear hit + paralizing blow on player 2.
Buddy 1: Guarantied doubleaxe hit on player 2.
Player 2: Paralized for 3 seconds.
Player 1: Gets one more swing (50% change) at player 2.
Buddy 1: Gets one more swing (50% change) at player 2.

That would create some serious opening damage without the ability to react from player 2.

EZ solution: 5 second timeout on guaranteed hits

 

[Wizx13]

Make mages miss same rate as dexers can. Nothing like shooting 5 e bolts and missing

 

[Keltonator]

If you compare weapons, you see that slower weapons do less damage over time, but have a higher alpha damage.
If you implement a guarantied hit system, you can 'prepare' it by sparring with a buddy.

Now combine those two factors and you get this:
Player 1: Guarantied spear hit + paralizing blow on player 2.
Player 2: Paralized for 3 seconds.
Player 1: Gets one more swing (50% change) at player 2.

Now lets say player 1 comes with buddy 1:
Player 1: Guarantied spear hit + paralizing blow on player 2.
Buddy 1: Guarantied doubleaxe hit on player 2.
Player 2: Paralized for 3 seconds.
Player 1: Gets one more swing (50% change) at player 2.
Buddy 1: Gets one more swing (50% change) at player 2.

That would create some serious opening damage without the ability to react from player 2.

Axes don't deal para blow, but I see your point and I'd be pissed if I was player 2 either way.

 

[Elizabeth Gold]

Axes don't deal para blow, but I see your point and I'd be pissed if I was player 2 either way.

Buddy 1 is the axewielder, he's just doing damage. It's the paralyze from player 1 that I'm referring to.

 

[Winstonian]

If you compare weapons, you see that slower weapons do less damage over time, but have a higher alpha damage.
If you implement a guarantied hit system, you can 'prepare' it by sparring with a buddy.

I still think that the 1h damage over time is superior to 2h damage over time, and the hit frequency of a fast weapon is huge. Missing one swing with a slow 2 handed weapon is nearly certain death against a mage.

Your point about preparing guaranteed hit is good. There's also the fact that mages could base their casting around hits and misses, which is bad for dexers. Guaranteed hit/miss isn't the solution.

 

[Trojandrew]

@wreckognize dont think it should be as simple as miss X amount of times for a guaranteed strike or visa versa. because even if this is more meant on a larger fight scale it would still apply to 1v1 and small battles as well. do you know how many mages would save an explosion ebolt combo for that time they know you're going to miss your swing because you can count it? (even if they are throwing pots which show a timer, or switch to a 1h weapon in the hopes of a faster swing reset, the predictability is still there.)

what if you had a miss counter so to say. it takes swing speed into account. every time you miss with a weapon the gauge fills up. max fill you WILL hit. now slower swing weapons will fill the gauge much faster than faster weapons, but you wouldnt be able to predict exactly when. They would also have to have the gauge bar lose points for every time you arent either preparing to swing (right next to a person or within a few tiles waiting on your next swing) so you cant just fill up your gauge on a mob then go run after someone to auto hit.

the upside to this gauge is that if you are in combat, hitting DOESN"T take away from it. you can hit, miss, hit, miss, hit, miss, then gauge fills and you hit. this would keep the predictability low.

 

[manolo]

frustrated knights lawl

 

[halygon]

I still think that the 1h damage over time is superior to 2h damage over time, and the hit frequency of a fast weapon is huge. Missing one swing with a slow 2 handed weapon is nearly certain death against a mage.

2h LJ Character will nearly always beat a 1h dexxor in straight up hit-for-hit competitions. This has been proven in the RNG tourneys that the event masters put on from time to time. A 2h macer will also beat most 1h dexxors too due to burst damage - although they will die to the 2h LJ.

Basically the idea here is to eliminate long streaks of hits or misses which are causing a significant number of the playerbase frustration.

The idea is that if you are holding a 2 handed weapon, then you will automatically hit after 2 misses in a row, or vice versa, you will automatically miss if you hit twice in a row.

With one handed weapons this changes to an automatic hit every 3 misses in a row, or vice versa, an automatic miss every 3 hits in a row.

Now if say you were holding a 2 handed weapon, and hit twice in a row, you may not want to miss that third time, so what you can do is switch to a 1 hander. In place of an automatic miss, your swing timer is simply reset.

Personally I feel as though this may really be the once-and-for-all way to balance mages and townfighters in Ultima Online.

Thoughts?

Would this be for PvM AND PvP or both? For the times that you do not have a guaranteed hit or miss, is the hit mechanics the same as they currently are?

Also, what is your business case for needing this change? Outside of the occasional archer complaint, there have not been any complaints about this.

It is a completely random 50% chance to hit - assuming both parties are GM in their weapon skill. The exception to this is with archery where bows with accuracy modifiers actually have a significantly higher chance to hit.

 

[stunoma.]

While we are at it make mages never miss stuns (not being serious)


I am not a big nerd in the mechanics aspect of the game but isn't the reason you are missing is because mages have wrestling. So basically you are asking wrestling to be nerfed.

Pretty ridiculous

But who knows like I said I may have it all wrong

 

[Trojandrew]

It is a completely random 50% chance to hit - assuming both parties are GM in their weapon skill.

Just curious, what is the chance, on hit, if the other party has parry? would that 50% change include the block, or is there another set of rng to go through to get by the block as well.

 

[Young Star]

I don't agree with a guaranteed hit. That seems like something that could be exploited when you know you are guaranteed to not miss on your next swing. I think a better option would be to have your hit chance increase incrementally with every miss. Once you hit, it resets. Change targets or disarm weapon, it resets. The incremental HCI would also only last 2x the swing speed of the weapon. So if you off screen or dance around your target, it resets.

 

[halygon]

Just curious, what is the chance, on hit, if the other party has parry? would that 50% change include the block, or is there another set of rng to go through to get by the block as well.

There is not a hit difference. The hit chance is still the same, but the parry chance is just calculated on top of it once the hit actually is successful.

 

[GluttonySDS]

Im shocked people are actually talking about changing the melee hit chance system which is perfectly balanced... sure you miss 10 times in a row but youll then hit 10 times in a row and straight rape people. Its why dexxers take little skill and lots of luck and are perfect for newer players to start out PVPing with.

 

[Young Star]

I never once hit that many times in a row EVER. I don't have a problem with making it work both ways though