amonseti
Grandmaster
Multiclient Cheating Pirates
- Thread starter Li Meiyang
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wreckognize
Grandmaster
As a veteran player here I have witnessed multiclient piracy happen and never be punished in the entire span of UOF history.
Dewderonomy and crew were notorious for archer bots, and the only thing that staff ever did was support them, even adding the function of ship ransoming at one point. I remember a time when the same player who blocked @Li Meiyang 's ship also blocked dewderonomys ship, and after dewdy and his entire crew paged staff, staff returned the multiclienters ship back to him lol.
In all, multiclient piracy is fair game here based on years of it going unpunished. In fact with the current mechanics it's necessary, because if you die on your ship to mobs your only recourse is to bring an alt there because ghosts can't control ships, so it makes sense to have an alt aboard with you.
I recently was a member of Redrum, and I asked a few members what the policy was on multiclienting since the boat changes. They all had the same thing to say. Everyone does it so it's even.
Besides, they're pirates. Hello? What are you expecting
Personally though because of the complete disregard for strict policy on how staff interacts with players here when it comes to the rules, I've chosen to just stay off the water. Never know when doing something in a grey area is going to bite you in the ass here.
In fact, I was recently informed about how a guildmate was jailed for spamming excessively at wbb. Spamming isn't even illegal, but apparently my guildmate was told that he had quite a few pages against him. Then a little while later he was informed by JoeB that he would be banned if he continued to dispel another players gates at wbb, because ''all he does is grief'' which isn't even true, not against the rules even if it was true, and only being harrassed by staff because of the amount of pages against him recently.
So in reality, on UOF you play legit at your own risk. Don't get too many pages against you is really the golden rule here.
Dewderonomy and crew were notorious for archer bots, and the only thing that staff ever did was support them, even adding the function of ship ransoming at one point. I remember a time when the same player who blocked @Li Meiyang 's ship also blocked dewderonomys ship, and after dewdy and his entire crew paged staff, staff returned the multiclienters ship back to him lol.
In all, multiclient piracy is fair game here based on years of it going unpunished. In fact with the current mechanics it's necessary, because if you die on your ship to mobs your only recourse is to bring an alt there because ghosts can't control ships, so it makes sense to have an alt aboard with you.
I recently was a member of Redrum, and I asked a few members what the policy was on multiclienting since the boat changes. They all had the same thing to say. Everyone does it so it's even.
Besides, they're pirates. Hello? What are you expecting
Personally though because of the complete disregard for strict policy on how staff interacts with players here when it comes to the rules, I've chosen to just stay off the water. Never know when doing something in a grey area is going to bite you in the ass here.
In fact, I was recently informed about how a guildmate was jailed for spamming excessively at wbb. Spamming isn't even illegal, but apparently my guildmate was told that he had quite a few pages against him. Then a little while later he was informed by JoeB that he would be banned if he continued to dispel another players gates at wbb, because ''all he does is grief'' which isn't even true, not against the rules even if it was true, and only being harrassed by staff because of the amount of pages against him recently.
So in reality, on UOF you play legit at your own risk. Don't get too many pages against you is really the golden rule here.
Li Meiyang
Grandmaster
I'm sorry, but none of those arguments hold any water whatsoever.
"They're pirates, so what do you expect?"
You can role play anything on UO. You can be an orc, an elf, or even a martian if you want to. In no way should your RPing choices give you carte blanche to CHEAT.
Pirates have already got an overpowered GUNSHIP to harass fisherfolk with. The fact that they possess all this EXTRA power somehow justifies their right to multiclient PVP? By that logic, tamers should also be granted this special privilege.
"It sucks to be ghost on a ship, so they bring alts."
Boo hoo hoo! It also sucks to be a fisherghost on a ship after a pirate attack. Multiclient backup would be useful in any number of other PVP situations too, but IT IS AGAINST THE RULES.
This really isn't a gray area. Multiclient PVPing is against the rules, period. You want to go around harassing fishers on your superpowered galleon, okay, but you don't get to bring an alt along. Or you get your account banned for muliclient pvp. Simple as that.
(The telescope house, btw, looks fantastic! Really nice work. I'm glad you got it now and I hope it stays that way.)
"They're pirates, so what do you expect?"
You can role play anything on UO. You can be an orc, an elf, or even a martian if you want to. In no way should your RPing choices give you carte blanche to CHEAT.
Pirates have already got an overpowered GUNSHIP to harass fisherfolk with. The fact that they possess all this EXTRA power somehow justifies their right to multiclient PVP? By that logic, tamers should also be granted this special privilege.
"It sucks to be ghost on a ship, so they bring alts."
Boo hoo hoo! It also sucks to be a fisherghost on a ship after a pirate attack. Multiclient backup would be useful in any number of other PVP situations too, but IT IS AGAINST THE RULES.
This really isn't a gray area. Multiclient PVPing is against the rules, period. You want to go around harassing fishers on your superpowered galleon, okay, but you don't get to bring an alt along. Or you get your account banned for muliclient pvp. Simple as that.
(The telescope house, btw, looks fantastic! Really nice work. I'm glad you got it now and I hope it stays that way.)
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Li Meiyang
Grandmaster
Taken from http://www.uoforever.com/rules.php
"Players may not use TWO OR MORE clients at the same time to PvP."
Dems da rules. Clear as F-ing crystal.
"Players may not use TWO OR MORE clients at the same time to PvP."
Dems da rules. Clear as F-ing crystal.
wreckognize
Grandmaster
Fair enough. However... I'm not sure that your description of the events here have constituted multiclient 'pvp'
it's not like he was using 3 archers to simultaneously damage you, or 3 tamers to do the same thing, which is what most players are doing when it comes to boat PvP.
it's not like he was using 3 archers to simultaneously damage you, or 3 tamers to do the same thing, which is what most players are doing when it comes to boat PvP.
MANKRIK
Grandmaster
I've always taken it to mean simultaneous actions by multiple alts (all 3 attacking you at once). If he is using alts one by one (brings boat in, brings another boat in, brings galleon in) then it might be legal, who knows.
Li Meiyang
Grandmaster
He's attacking me, using multiple clients. Even if the those other clients are not attacking directly, the fact they are coming in on ships to block me are certainly a violation of the rules because it still constitutes "using TWO OR MORE clients to PvP." The ship blocking is a PvP tactic, yes? It's not like he's just aesthetically arranging ships for artistic purposes, then by pure chance also happens to choose to attack.
Li Meiyang
Grandmaster
No. The rule is "two or more clients to pvp." There's no qualification they be operating simultaneously. In fact, I'll need to check the rules again, but I think simultaneous movement on two or more clients is also illegal.... under ANY circumstances.
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Li Meiyang
Grandmaster
Here it is. Again, from http://www.uoforever.com/rules.php
"Simultaneously playing MORE THAN ONE SINGLE ACCOUNT at any time is prohibited (Moving on TWO or MORE accounts at any given time). "
That's not for PvP. That's ever at all.
"Simultaneously playing MORE THAN ONE SINGLE ACCOUNT at any time is prohibited (Moving on TWO or MORE accounts at any given time). "
That's not for PvP. That's ever at all.
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wreckognize
Grandmaster
I think that means the character itself has to be moving, not just on a moving ship.
Li Meiyang
Grandmaster
Yeah, I take it to mean that also. Maybe a GM could clarify. But "using two or more clients for PvP" doesn't have that that stipulation. The prohibition against dual client movement is a general rule for any situation.
GreedMongrel
Apprentice
So I fired at his boat block alt, he chases me with it trying to cut me off. Grappling hooks with his alt onto my boat, then in about 1 second flat places FIVE boats perfectly around mine, then he brings his galleon. Can the admins do something about this person?
names of his characters:
yoar (blocking alt)
davida valtieri
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Li Meiyang
Grandmaster
Yeah, those are the same two chars that did this crap to me several times. I'd say that if "yoar" is Valteiri's alt, (and I imagine they can check this to see if they are logging in with the same IP easily enough) this is pretty much an open and shut case of multiclient PvP cheating. Permanent ban seems appropriate here.
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Tydeus
Master
He is using alts to setup his initial traps. Yoar is his scout. There are so many grey areas when it comes to multi-client PvP on a boat. I don't consider him to be a cheater, and even if he somehow is, I wouldn't whine about it. Find ways around it, be prepared, come up with a plan, etc.
Davida Valtieri appears to be his only attacking pirate that he will fire arrows and cannons with. What if he came along when all 3 of my fishers, who are archers, are fishing for serpents? I can legally use all three of those archers to defend myself...in fact, they will automatically defend by shooting arrows once attacked. That is using 3 clients to PvP with, but I wasn't the one attacking, so it is not against the rules that my archers fire back.
All of my boats are level 1 and the cannons are left unloaded. I haven't been active in the fishing game until recently, or else I would have stuck around and had some fun with a leveled up boat. Right now I'm just recalling out, except for I managed to kill his scout when he tried pirating me the other day, and I got some free nets and MiBs (lol). First priority for me is to recall out on any toons that have valuables, like treasure chests and SoS messages.
That boat blocking trick isn't a cheat and if you run a macro that targets ship models by type in a loop you can place boats fast like that. I don't know about 4 boats in 1 second, but maybe you're exaggerating...
Davida Valtieri appears to be his only attacking pirate that he will fire arrows and cannons with. What if he came along when all 3 of my fishers, who are archers, are fishing for serpents? I can legally use all three of those archers to defend myself...in fact, they will automatically defend by shooting arrows once attacked. That is using 3 clients to PvP with, but I wasn't the one attacking, so it is not against the rules that my archers fire back.
All of my boats are level 1 and the cannons are left unloaded. I haven't been active in the fishing game until recently, or else I would have stuck around and had some fun with a leveled up boat. Right now I'm just recalling out, except for I managed to kill his scout when he tried pirating me the other day, and I got some free nets and MiBs (lol). First priority for me is to recall out on any toons that have valuables, like treasure chests and SoS messages.
That boat blocking trick isn't a cheat and if you run a macro that targets ship models by type in a loop you can place boats fast like that. I don't know about 4 boats in 1 second, but maybe you're exaggerating...
GreedMongrel
Apprentice
Yes we know how to play. Still there are rules. Multi client pvp is against the rules for many good reasons. And the script he used to place the boats did it in 1 second. He also fired on me with his alt...
Jax Monroe
Master
Yoar has done this for years. Never ever has it been an issue before. Meaning staff doesn't see it as cheating. You can bring it up to them and all that but I'm pretty sure they're not going to see it as cheating.
Decreamos
Grandmaster
Looks like cheating to me. No different than casting wall of stone with one char and attacking with your other char.
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Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
wreckognize
Grandmaster
I call bullshit on this. Same principle as using 3 tamers in an RDA. people are going to end up being hit by multiple pets when they attack two characters that are being guarded.
Add a new rule that only allows 1 fisherman on a ship at any given time, punishable by account ban. Because shits gonna go down, no way to prevent it!
LAWL JUST KIDDING! WAT A JOKE RULE!
Li Meiyang
Grandmaster
Yeah, great idea. Let's punish the fisherfolk who are getting harassed constantly by these bozos.
Multi-clienting PvP is against the rules, but what the hey, let's try to obfuscate this clear line by playing "blame the victim."
Yeah, they never get anything off me either. No upgrades and I bring my chests in one or two at at time. At most they get a couple dozen arrows and a few recall scrolls.
Someone's gonna harass my fisher WITHIN the rules, I might gripe about it but otherwise deal with it. But if they CHEAT to do it, you can be damned sure I'm gonna make an issue out of it. It's fkn CHEATING!
What is it about "Players may not use TWO OR MORE clients at the same time to PvP" is so F-ing hard to understand??? There seems to be this force at work here to corrupt this clear line for some reason, and justify breaking it. But it's a core rule. I don't think they should ban the player actually, that's maybe a little too harsh, but it's got to at least warrant a warning. Then if he cheats again bag him for it.
Multi-clienting PvP is against the rules, but what the hey, let's try to obfuscate this clear line by playing "blame the victim."
Yeah, they never get anything off me either. No upgrades and I bring my chests in one or two at at time. At most they get a couple dozen arrows and a few recall scrolls.
Someone's gonna harass my fisher WITHIN the rules, I might gripe about it but otherwise deal with it. But if they CHEAT to do it, you can be damned sure I'm gonna make an issue out of it. It's fkn CHEATING!
What is it about "Players may not use TWO OR MORE clients at the same time to PvP" is so F-ing hard to understand??? There seems to be this force at work here to corrupt this clear line for some reason, and justify breaking it. But it's a core rule. I don't think they should ban the player actually, that's maybe a little too harsh, but it's got to at least warrant a warning. Then if he cheats again bag him for it.
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Yoar
Adept
This rule:
"Players may not use TWO OR MORE clients at the same time to PvP." (http://www.uoforever.com/rules.php),
states that I cannot pvp with more than one player at the same time. As Hanes stated, I only deal damage with Davida Valtieri, not with my scout. While I am attacking you on Davida, I am not actually using Yoar to do anything. By then, he's done his job blocking you. (During the time I'm blocking you, it might be a good idea to recall out.)
This rule:
"Simultaneously playing MORE THAN ONE SINGLE ACCOUNT at any time is prohibited (Moving on TWO or MORE accounts at any given time). " (http://www.uoforever.com/rules.php),
was specifically added to prevent PVP/PK scripters (correct me if I'm wrong). Again, I'm only using one account to attack you. If this rule applied to every situation, you could argue that you cannot use multiple fishermen at the same time for they would all move (on the same boat) at the same time. Or you could not run a mining macro on one char and PVM on another char.
I either misinterpret the last rule, in which case I and many others are breaking the rules (still not cheating), or the rule is loosely stated.
In any case, I invite you to capture our next encounter on video. Would you send me a copy? Thanks.
Yoar
"Players may not use TWO OR MORE clients at the same time to PvP." (http://www.uoforever.com/rules.php),
states that I cannot pvp with more than one player at the same time. As Hanes stated, I only deal damage with Davida Valtieri, not with my scout. While I am attacking you on Davida, I am not actually using Yoar to do anything. By then, he's done his job blocking you. (During the time I'm blocking you, it might be a good idea to recall out.)
This rule:
"Simultaneously playing MORE THAN ONE SINGLE ACCOUNT at any time is prohibited (Moving on TWO or MORE accounts at any given time). " (http://www.uoforever.com/rules.php),
was specifically added to prevent PVP/PK scripters (correct me if I'm wrong). Again, I'm only using one account to attack you. If this rule applied to every situation, you could argue that you cannot use multiple fishermen at the same time for they would all move (on the same boat) at the same time. Or you could not run a mining macro on one char and PVM on another char.
I either misinterpret the last rule, in which case I and many others are breaking the rules (still not cheating), or the rule is loosely stated.
In any case, I invite you to capture our next encounter on video. Would you send me a copy? Thanks.
Yoar
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