No End Game Potential for Non-Tamers

[Tard the Paladin]

I've got my defense talisman to level 10 and its awesome but it still pales in comparison to the other classes.

Tamers with a maxed out meta pet have way more PVM potential than anything else. Anyone that says differently needs to actually observe a maxed out meta in action. You will never kill the high level mobs or get champ scores like a tamer. Yes, I realize it sucks when they die and there's a lot more risk involved. But the fact remains that tamers are the only class with end game potential.

Give us something to work for that can compete. The dexer and mage talismans were an amazing first step but we need to continue down the path. I could make a tamer but I find mages and dexers much more appealing. I would like to see the end game content for all classes balanced out.

Let me be clear that I think the end game content for classes should also be balanced in terms of grinding involved and risk undertaken. If it sucks to have a meta pet die then it should suck for a meta dexer/mage to die as well.

There tons of neat ideas that could be brainstormed but I think the first step is addressing the overall issue.

One of the main things lacking for a meta dexer in particular is that there is no end game arsenal to obtain. Think about it. Tamers have mega monsters that decimate any high level mob and rack up huge champ scores. A maxed out meta pet sells for 15 mil or more. That is a huge end game weapon to have in one's arsenal. Even meta-mages can obtain one of the coveted super slayer spellbooks for around the same price tag. Dexers have no end game goodies. Even if you spent a couple mil on a valorite weapon there's really no place to use it besides CTF events and the like.

In no way do I think tamers should be nerfed. A ton of players love playing tamers and I'm glad that there are exciting and profitable end game possibilities for them. I would like to see mages and dexers have the same opportunity. A UOF that caters to different play styles would be even more amazing.

 

[Lexington]

Considering that the tamer is by far the hardest and most expensive to build... doesn't it make sense that it is and should always be the Alpha?? Yes, yes it does

Anyways, being a player that is at "end game" I have to disagree that there isn't any end game potential for non tamers. I'm having a blast leveling my meta mage. IMO, it's the best UO end game addition ever. Sure I'm not going to top the damage boards for champs and such but if you're truly at "end game" you don't give a shit about being the best, you just care about having fun while playing!!

 

[Tard the Paladin]

I clearly stated that making a tamer involves more risk and more effort. In fact I prepended that acknowledgement with "Let me be clear that...".

What I am proposing is making the same true for other classes. Give warriors and mages the abilitiy to make a hard and expensive character class. Meta mage and Meta dexers are a step in the right direction but are not end game. Many others feel likewise. There's no need for one class to dominate entirely. There are many exciting ways to add balance to the game.

I also agree that end game means just enjoying the game. Giving your main character the opportunity to further advance their abilities in challenging ways is the perfect way to give depth to the game. Myself, I love champs, pvp, and all the other great end game content. What I would like to see implemented is a chance to give a main character more depth.

 

[DalMichaelLas]

What to do you mean by end game? I have fallon loches gloves, just sold the first buhamut statue, gravestone, fallon statue collection, 2 mil in gold and I dont even pvm anymore. All with no tamer. I used to get top score or close to top at any champ I was at from the start so dexers dominate champs, and several of the RDAs can be done without a tamer. Not to mention pvp, idocs, poker, etc are all considered end game and do not require a tamer. So Im not really sure what you are asking for? You want to tank high end mobs on a dexer or a mage? Not going to happen, make a tamer. Or provo, you can provo almost anything on this shard.

 

[wreckognize]

how about small chance to get cool deco items related to the class involved once using level 10 tali if you land a killshot?

or cloth?

 

[Lexington]

I clearly stated that making a tamer involves more risk and more effort. In fact I prepended that acknowledgement with "Let me be clear that...".

What I am proposing is making the same true for other classes. Give warriors and mages the abilitiy to make a hard and expensive character class. Meta mage and Meta dexers are a step in the right direction but are not end game. Many others feel likewise. There's no need for one class to dominate entirely. There are many exciting ways to add balance to the game.

I hear you... but why does end game content always have to compete with top DPS? Being able to compete or dominate PVM isn't the end game I'd be looking for. I don't even play my tamer anymore because it's boring. FYI, leveling a meta mage, while playing, its hard as #(%# and expensive.

 

[DalMichaelLas]

dexers dominate champs,

how about small chance to get cool deco items related to the class involved once using level 10 tali if you land a killshot?

or cloth?

That really has nothing to do with what he is talking about lol but not a bad idea.

 

[DalMichaelLas]

I hear you... but why does end game content always have to compete with top DPS? Being able to compete or dominate PVM isn't the end game I'd be looking for. I don't even play my tamer anymore because it's boring. FYI, leveling a meta mage, while playing, its hard as #(%# and expensive.

What you guys apparently dont get is that tamers are not top DPS they are just good tanks. Dexer with slayer will out dps tamers all day including at champ spawns.

 

[Lexington]

how about small chance to get cool deco items related to the class involved once using level 10 tali if you land a killshot?

or cloth?

See... here is a cool end game idea that doesn't involve dominating PVM.

 

[DalMichaelLas]

Ok maybe im the one missing OPs point. I will wait for him to get back to clarify before we start arguing about nothing.

 

[Tard the Paladin]

What to do you mean by end game? I have fallon loches gloves, just sold the first buhamut statue, gravestone, fallon statue collection, 2 mil in gold and I dont even pvm anymore. All with no tamer. I used to get top score or close to top at any champ I was at from the start so dexers dominate champs, and several of the RDAs can be done without a tamer. Not to mention pvp, idocs, poker, etc are all considered end game and do not require a tamer. So Im not really sure what you are asking for? You want to tank high end mobs on a dexer or a mage? Not going to happen, make a tamer. Or provo, you can provo almost anything on this shard.

No dexer can compete with a level 7 meta in a champ. Not by a long shot. I often outperform tamers at champs but a maxed out level 7 wipes the floor. The point I'm making is not simply about being able to tackle larger mobs though that is a symptom of the imbalance that I am addressing. The focus of my post is to encourage UOF to develop additional content to further develop other classes in a way that is similar to the strength that tamers possess. There are other posts on this forum about ideas to add content for mages and warriors. I'm sure there are other great ideas for additional content as well.

In a lot of great games that are RPG-based you see different character classes that have different strengths and capabilities but at end game they are all capable of doing some amazing things. Right now, tamers are the only class that have truly spectacular end game ability. This is a great. In fact I hope that tamers get more end game content as well. What is also needed is the chance for warriors and mages to also have similar opportunities for end game ability.

 

[Lexington]

What you guys apparently dont get is that tamers are not top DPS they are just good tanks. Dexer with slayer will out dps tamers all day including at champ spawns.

We'll if this is true... it sure as hell sounds like some serious end game reward.

 

[Tard the Paladin]

See... here is a cool end game idea that doesn't involve dominating PVM.

This is a cool idea. But there is no reason for tamers to have dominance over PVM ability. As long as other character classes put in the same time, effort, and risk involved as tamers into developing their characters then it is in no way unfair to have similar PVM ability.

 

[wreckognize]

There's plenty of reasons why tamers should dominate. I would agree that the classes could be brought closer together if talisman relics were character bound, since it easily takes as long to get a relic as it does to make a tamer.

In the meantime though, I think it would be cool if there was some kind of aesthetic reward to having leveled tali/relics. You can't even show them off, people can't just click your doll and see what you're packin. I think it would be cool if talisman or each relic had a small chance to get a cool item.

So basically you'd get the item bound to your character, it would go to your bank directly, and maybe a higher chance based on the tier mob slain.

Then we could have cool items like mount dyes for Tread users, etc etc.

I dunno, something aesthetic is the only endgame avenue I can see for talisman users the way the system is set up right now.

 

[Tard the Paladin]

We'll if this is true... it sure as hell sounds like some serious end game reward.

When it comes to dexers being able to compete with a level 7 meta pet at a champ spawn I feel that this easily verified as not being the case at all. If others aren't convinced of what I perceive as an easily verified fact then that's ok, there's no point into getting into a "yes they can, no they can't" debate. The main point I am making is that there is a need for more end game content for warriors and mages.

 

[Lexington]

This is a cool idea. But there is no reason for tamers to have dominance over PVM ability. As long as other character classes put in the same time, effort, and risk involved as tamers into developing their characters then it is in no way unfair to have similar PVM ability.

I can't speak for meta dexers... but I can tell you my meta mage is level 5 with two relics and he/she (Bruce Jenner moment) is kicking ass. I can't wait to see the damage at level 10.

 

[Tard the Paladin]

There's plenty of reasons why tamers should dominate. I would agree that the classes could be brought closer together if talisman relics were character bound, since it easily takes as long to get a relic as it does to make a tamer.

In the meantime though, I think it would be cool if there was some kind of aesthetic reward to having leveled tali/relics. You can't even show them off, people can't just click your doll and see what you're packin. I think it would be cool if talisman or each relic had a small chance to get a cool item.

So basically you'd get the item bound to your character, it would go to your bank directly, and maybe a higher chance based on the tier mob slain.

Then we could have cool items like mount dyes for Tread users, etc etc.

I dunno, something aesthetic is the only endgame avenue I can see the way the system is set up right now.

Wreckognize, maybe you have a point that I simply don't understand. Why should other classes not have similar PVM ability to that of tamers? That is so long as the other classes also must forth the time, effort, and risk that tamers do. If all classes face equal challenges and risk then why not let them have similar PVM ability?

 

[Tard the Paladin]

I can't speak for meta dexers... but I can tell you my meta mage is level 5 with two relics and he/she (Bruce Jenner moment) is kicking ass. I can't wait to see the damage at level 10.

I can't speak for meta mages but from what I've heard from guildies who maxed them out, it doesn't seem like they have the end game potential to that of tamers. But one cool thing that mages have that dexers don't are the super slayer spellbooks. Yes they are super rare and valuable but at least they are out there to set your sights on for an end game goal. Dexers don't really have those types of items out there. It would be cool if they did and hopefully we'll see something comparable in the future.

 

[DalMichaelLas]

Maybe, I havnt done a champ in a while, but there were meta pets when I was doing them and I would often be top 3 and the ones that beat me were other dexers.

 

[Lexington]

I can't speak for meta mages but from what I've heard from guildies who maxed them out, it doesn't seem like they have the end game potential to that of tamers. But one cool thing that mages have that dexers don't are the super slayer spellbooks. Yes they are super rare and valuable but at least they are out there to set your sights on for an end game goal. Dexers don't really have those types of items out there. It would be cool if they did and hopefully we'll see something comparable in the future.

There are all kinds of slayer weapons out there..........